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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    35

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    Hello,

    I spent some weeks to trial various sync tools, and discovered FSS on my own, before reading this thread here. I'd like to say that FreeSurfer is perfectly right in my opinion, up to the implementation details, which appear perfect to me, especially in view of the fact that they do NOT suppose the existence of a database.

    I now know virtually all of the tools available, even exotic ones, and I've read a lot of things concerning BC in this respect. All people are unanimous, everywhere in the web: BC is absolutely great (and in my opinion, the graphical representation of folder compare within BC is the best on the market), BUT your stance of "people could write a script of their own" in order to use BC for automated / half-automated synching" is unacceptable (since most people ain't able to do it, knowledge-wise or time-wise), and does HARM your business.

    At the end of the day, file compare is mostly for developers, almost all of which probably own BC, since it's so incredibly powerful (even if I systematically bum my head at its limitations, without even trying to do so)... but the REAL market is with synching... even me acknowledging that more and more synch jobs being done cloud-wise, I would predict, though, that BC, with a little (optional) automatism, could get a very nice market share of the sync tools market...

    Especially considering that with the graphical representation (and going with it, the real comparing job), you already did 3/4 or more of the work needed ; a little bit scripting of YOUR side, and implementation of it in order for customers to have easy access to it, would not be that difficult, it seems to me, but greatly enhance your customer base.

    And even for the renamed "folders / files" detection, that wouldn't be too difficult, it seems, the way I imagined it, and the very way FreeSurfer, preceding my hint, has stated it, with half-automation, i.e. dialog boxes in the kind of folders "c:\path\x seems to be to 90/100/50... [i.e. depending on the percentage of "different" files] p.c. (!) identical to "d:\path\y - did you rename/move it? Yes/No", with "Yes" triggering automatic renaming/moving of the corresponding structure within the target.

    Technically, btw, it does NOT seem to be that difficult, please refer to this FSS thread which gives highly interesting details :

    http://sourceforge.net/projects/free.../topic/4837086

    As a conclusion to my various trials, I must say I'm VERY disappointed by the commercial offerings, especially ViceVersa Pro is 60 dollars, PLUS a 25 dollars trigger tool which should be included, and NOT having any rename / move detection, in spite (!) of maintaining a db (which is incredible)!

    The same goes for the 55 dollars SyncBack Pro, which is a rather minor offering, in spite of a lot of (sham?) raves not justified in any way in my opinion; it seems to have a unique feature, back-up of mail accounts, but then, it does NOT retrieve mails out of folders within Pop3 accounts (which would have been a really exceptional thing indeed), but for IMAP accounts, you can do the same with lots of freeware, no 60 dollars needed for that.

    In both cases, the 35 dollar versions are heavily crippled - so much that there isn't any interest in buyint them, as I see it.

    Not any of the 20 to 40 dollar offerings are worth the effort, considering there's FSS, for free, and just imagine the versioning features of the 60 dollar programs, doing thousands (or more) of unnecessary file replicates, just because they don't "see" the archived "originals" have just been renamed / moved within your source structure : for 60 dollars, they create total chaos (let alone for disk space, let alone for delta inability (cf. monster db's like the Outlook one).

    In fact, and in my several-months' experience now, versioning is good for special folders (with their sub-folders), for "active" files (i.e. your "own" files you work on), but isn't that helpful for myriads of external reference files of various sources (and where the problem lies not in working on them, but precisely in renaming and moving them), hence the need for two different archiving strategies, archiving of "active" files, frequent and with versioning, of reference material, infrequent and without versioning, and perhaps, applied to the second group of files, an infrequent "total snapshot" as intermediate archives "in case of".

    So what do I do, in practice? For my active files, it's frequent use of FSS, and for "the grand total", it's ViceVersa FREE, since I like its graphical representation of comparing the whole stuff second-best (after BC, but where any half-automatic proceeding is missing for the time being), and then, I do manual renames / moves of renamed / moved folders / files, running the VV Free Compare window again and again, up to the point where I leave it to VV to do the remaining, automatic, "real" synch job.

    This way, I have a good, quick look at renames / moves of thousands of items, instead of having it all done automatically and "behind my back", but I'd like to have better (half-) automatic processing indeed, as stated above.

    For people wanting to buy such sw, I recommend "Super Flexible", but for me, I prefer my current scenario described above (VV Free being 1.05, vs. VV Pro being in version 2.5, I can't see any real difference for me there (and in VV's update politics, there is no clemency either, cf. their forum on this subject), whilst the free version of SyncBack, e.g., is potentially dangerous (no UTF-8)

    - but I would very much like to have some more functionality within BC, and happy to discard both FSS and VVF for doing my work within BC.

    And I'm sure most current BC users would happily agree, with many newcomers buying BC for that very principal use, file comparison coming as a nice good-to-have-also for them.

    Most of the necessary work implied seems to be done already, so...

    EDIT : Some more info (and links) here :

    http://serverfault.com/questions/205...rename-windows

    EDIT 2 :
    I didn't bother to add a list of numerous sw's I didn't consider anyway but having trialled GoodSync 8, I now read brand-new GoodSync 9 is out, with the following new features, delta-copying AND folder / file rename ( / move) detection (and correct processing then ; whilst e.g. SyncBack only has got file (i.e. not the much more important folder) renaming detection, and in most obscure settings, only available for some kind of jobs). The only - persisting - problem with GS thus is price, since I'm certainly not going to shed out 30 bucks PER COMP (! (see their license)). (BTW, SuperFlexible (Prof. 60 $ plus VAT, and yes, they also have crippleware at... 35$- ain't there any laws against this?) is in 6 beta now, under the name of Syncovery - which doesn't change anything to its GUI (problems).)

    So, GS and SF/Sy seem to be the "serious" commercial offerings of the moment (VV being very special (and likeable in my opinion) in its GUI, but far too greedy, and not good enough in the absence of both delta and correct renames/moves processing).
    Last edited by purchase; 08-Jun-2012 at 08:48 AM.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    11,943

    Default

    Thanks for the feedback. It's still a larger project than it looks like, but I'll be sure to add your notes, suggestions, and examples to our Customer Wishlist entry. Our solution is not to make our customers perform scripting, but it is the best workaround we can offer at this time.
    Aaron P Scooter Software

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Spain
    Posts
    15

    Default

    <<'touch' the file/folder names and copy them from one side to the other is on our Customer Wishlist, but is not a currently supported feature.>>

    Another BC v3 owner is waiting for this feature in the wish list to be implemented soon... = )
    Thank you.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    35

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    Thank you, Aaron, for considering these. I know cloud solutions are taking a big share of the global synch market, but BC takes too tiny a share from that same market, as for now.

    I gave up on every other program for synching but for ViceVersa Free - the clarity of its compare window is so outstanding that I don't touch anything else for this anymore (and as for "versioning", here and then, I do a manual backup of the archive: not good, but better than nothing).

    The reason why I don't buy VV Prof: It's not the price (60 dollars), it's not the update pricing (high), it's not the absence of delta copying (my Outlook db isn't that big yet), it's an answer from the developers in May of this year, to a paying user of the program: They said, with respect to "smart" processing of folder renaming / shifting (= for the time being, VV considers all these files then as "new" and the files that are very well there, in renamed / shifted folders, as "deleted = to be deleted in the archive"), that they didn't know how to do it, whilst other contenders (of which I mentioned three here) of course do it, and some have been doing it for years.

    Thus, when the developers of the most expensive of the "normal" (non-corporate) synch tools pretend, in May 2012, to not know how to process renamed / shifted folders in any intelligent way, instead of having introduced such a functionality years ago (or at least working on such a functionality), I'm not buying.

    And so, my hopes for this go with BC - and of course, that would be a major upgrade, and many users would be happy to upgrade - or even, make it three versions instead of just two; normally, I'm agains such splitting up (see xplorer2 and their new "Ultimate" version: it's a shame), but for such a very special add-on, it would perhaps be justified - on the other hand, many BC users would only update but not upgrade then since they use lesser synch tools and would continue to do so if BC would do it only in an "Ultimate" or whatever version. And then, my idea was, the normal prof. BC version, WITH such a function, would get many NEW customers... ;-)

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Spain
    Posts
    15

    Default

    <<'touch' the file/folder names and copy them from one side to the other is on our Customer Wishlist, but is not a currently supported feature.>>



    ANY NEWS 16 months LATER, PLEASE? Any plans? Or just have to use ANOTHER sofware for that? =(

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
    11,943

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    Sorry, but we do not have an update for this at this time. BC3 does not currently support aligning by another criteria (to find the renames) or copying the file name across.
    Aaron P Scooter Software

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    6

    Default Updates

    I bought the upgrade license at your recommendation that it would do what I was asking for.

    When I stated how it still didn't work you said it was on the Customer Wishlist and nonchalantly apologized. This was two years ago, now. Any updates on this feature?

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
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    Hi Dan,

    In my original post, I thought you were attempting to align the renamed folders and offered a method to try the feature for free to make sure it met your needs. Re-reading the correspondence, I'm sorry for the confusion or lack of follow-up: I assumed the Alignment Overrides met most of your needs and allowed you to sync your files between the renamed folders. Renaming the folders themselves would need to be a separate task (either trimming with our Rename action, or manually renaming them with a script). If you had accidentally purchased BC3 Pro and found the current feature set would actually be unusable for you, I would have asked sooner for you to contact us at support@scootersoftware and we could work out a refund. In general, this is why we try to offer as fully featured a trial as we can; no purchase is necessary to test any part or functionality of BC3.

    This forum thread has evolved into a couple separate requests: touching the file name of aligned items (without needing to copy the full folder/file), and auto-detecting folders or files that have been renamed and align them. Both of which are projects we have not been able to tackle yet.

    If you'd like to see what we have been up to, our Changelog for BC3 is here:
    http://www.scootersoftware.com/ChangeLog.txt
    And for BC4's Beta, it's here:
    http://www.scootersoftware.com/beta.php?zz=beta4_log
    Aaron P Scooter Software

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    6

    Default

    Thanks, Aaron, for the quick reply, as usual. I am considerably disappointed that I can line them up and merge the files, but not the folders. I just can't imagine it's that much more of a step for the program, at that point, to also rename the folders.

    That being said, I am otherwise extremely pleased with Beyond Compare. I use it very often and it is leaps and bounds above the other comparison programs I've used. I'm not sure I really ever use the Pro features, though.

    Can you please elaborate on what you meant by "(either trimming with our Rename action...)"?

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Madison, WI
    Posts
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    Our "Rename" supports DOS Masks or Regular Expressions. If you were trying to trim off the customized name and leave just the date, you could define a Regular Expression where the old mask matches the whole name, then the new mask is just the first half of that old name (trimming off the customized name). I'm not certain which direction your sync is performed, but if you needed to Copy the customized name over, that wouldn't be this feature.

    The Pro feature you were using was the Alignment Overrides (assuming you still have different names). That's what allows the folders of different names to align to copy the files left and right. In the Std version, we would need to rename the folders to all have equal names manually, at which point because they are equal they'd just align without issue.

    You can see a full list of the Pro specific features here:
    http://www.scootersoftware.com/shop.php?zz=kb_editions
    Aaron P Scooter Software

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